8.0 press release

Oleg,

what is a status of press release
http://cvs.pgfoundry.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/press/pr/releases/8.0/en/releas
e and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ?

Oh! We've been discussing this on the translators mailing list. I thought
you were subscribed. There's another Russian translator on the list who's
helping; can I subscribe you to coordinate?

--Josh

--
__Aglio Database Solutions_______________
Josh Berkus Consultant
josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com
Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387
2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA

Please join pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org where this has been being
reviewed, critisized and discussed for the past month or so :(

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Oleg Bartunov wrote:

Josh,

what is a status of press release
http://cvs.pgfoundry.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/press/pr/releases/8.0/en/release
and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ? What do you mean under
"To find out more about PostgreSQL or to download it, please visit:
In <your language here>
"
in press release and press page ? Does it means we (PGDG) bless some local
company to represent Pg in specific country ? I think no
and we should specify what do we want to see. For example:

1. Link to local server(s) of postgresql community
2. Link to download - local mirror of postgresql ftp-server
3. Links to companies offering commercial support

This way we'll support local postgresql community and give equal chance
for commercial companies.

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
TIP 9: the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your
joining column's datatypes do not match

----
Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org)
Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

what is a status of press release
http://cvs.pgfoundry.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/press/pr/releases/8.0/en/releas
e and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ?

Oh! We've been discussing this on the translators mailing list. I thought
you were subscribed. There's another Russian translator on the list who's
helping; can I subscribe you to coordinate?

I'm not sure it's a translator's deal ! It's sort of conceptual document
and best place is -advocacy,-hackers lists. I already contacted with N

--Josh

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Marc G. Fournier wrote:

Please join pgsql-advocacy@postgresql.org where this has been being reviewed,
critisized and discussed for the past month or so :(

just joined :)

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Oleg Bartunov wrote:

Josh,

what is a status of press release
http://cvs.pgfoundry.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/press/pr/releases/8.0/en/release
and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ? What do you mean under
"To find out more about PostgreSQL or to download it, please visit:
In <your language here>
"
in press release and press page ? Does it means we (PGDG) bless some local
company to represent Pg in specific country ? I think no
and we should specify what do we want to see. For example:

1. Link to local server(s) of postgresql community
2. Link to download - local mirror of postgresql ftp-server
3. Links to companies offering commercial support

This way we'll support local postgresql community and give equal chance
for commercial companies.

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
TIP 9: the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your
joining column's datatypes do not match

----
Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org)
Email: scrappy@hub.org Yahoo!: yscrappy ICQ: 7615664

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

Oleg,

I'm not sure it's a translator's deal ! It's sort of conceptual document
and best place is -advocacy,-hackers lists. I already contacted with N

Ah, well, in terms of the content, we've been going over it on the -Advocacy
list.

Will forward you my e-mail from translators.

--
__Aglio Database Solutions_______________
Josh Berkus Consultant
josh@agliodbs.com www.agliodbs.com
Ph: 415-752-2500 Fax: 415-752-2387
2166 Hayes Suite 200 San Francisco, CA

Oleg,

I'm worried about
support of local postgresql community and offical press release,
which will be copied/mirrored many times on many servers, is a good
chance for doin that.

Ok, I don't follow your question then. Can you be more explicit?

--
--Josh

Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

I'm worried about
support of local postgresql community and offical press release,
which will be copied/mirrored many times on many servers, is a good
chance for doin that.

Ok, I don't follow your question then. Can you be more explicit?

I cite myself (previous mail):
and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ? What do you mean under
"To find out more about PostgreSQL or to download it, please visit:
In <your language here>
"
in press release and press page ? Does it means we (PGDG) bless some local
company to represent Pg in specific country ? I think no
and we should specify what do we want to see. For example:

1. Link to local server(s) of postgresql community
2. Link to download - local mirror of postgresql ftp-server
3. Links to companies offering commercial support

This way we'll support local postgresql community and give equal chance
for commercial companies.

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

Oleg,

Discussion moved to ADVOCACY, where it belongs.

I cite myself (previous mail):
and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ? What do you mean under
"To find out more about PostgreSQL or to download it, please visit:
In <your language here>

Well, I still don't think I follow you. But that's where the "Regional
Contact" for the language will go. For example:

In Deutch:
http://www.postgres.de/
Anastasios Hatzis
Email: DE@postgresql.org
Tel: +49-30-20005022
Cell: +49-173-5625858

However, not all the Regional contacts are (self-)selected yet.

I was planning for Nick to be the Regional Contact for Russia, since last year
you were not able to find press contacts for Russia and Nick says that he has
some. OK?

1. Link to local server(s)  of postgresql community

Planned, see above. Of course, we don't have these for all communities.

2. Link to download - local mirror of postgresql ftp-server

Hmmm, this isn't a bad idea. Except that some languages don't correspond to
regions; Spanish for example. But it would work for Russian/Polish/German
etc. Do you think you could put together a list of mirrors which would match
closely with specific languages?

3. Links to companies offering commercial support

This is worthy of discussion, but would have had to been planned starting
about a month ago (if not earlier). At this time, translations have
already started on the release, with plans to have it ready within the next
10 days. If you want to start working on it now, our commercial support
page could certainly use some help ...

--
--Josh

Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

---559023410-521589464-1100300588=:25413
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=koi8-r; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT

Josh,

press release will be released on behalf of PGDG ? So, any contacts
will be considered sort of official ? There so many unclear questions,
so I tried to avoid them - publish well established regional addresses.
btw, what do you mean "press contact" ? I don't remember you asked me
for contact. I always have my contact (for decades) in my signature,
for example. We have well known postgresql resources in Russia and
I never heard Nickolay's company. Do we bless his company to be
our (PGDG) contact ? I'm against casual companies to be my representative
in my country !

Oleg

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

Discussion moved to ADVOCACY, where it belongs.

I cite myself (previous mail):
and it's translations ? Does it somehow confirmed ? What do you mean under
"To find out more about PostgreSQL or to download it, please visit:
1;2c1;2c In <your language here>

Well, I still don't think I follow you. But that's where the "Regional
Contact" for the language will go. For example:

In Deutch:
http://www.postgres.de/
Anastasios Hatzis
Email: DE@postgresql.org
Tel: +49-30-20005022
Cell: +49-173-5625858
1;2c
However, not all the Regional contacts are (self-)selected yet.

I was planning for Nick to be the Regional Contact for Russia, since last year
you were not able to find press contacts for Russia and Nick says that he has
some. OK?

1. Link to local server(s) О©╫of postgresql community

Planned, see above. Of course, we don't have these for all communities.

2.1;2c Link to download - local mirror of postgresql ftp-server

Hmmm, this isn't a bad idea. Except that some languages don't correspond to
regions; Spanish for example. But it would work for Russian/Polish/German
etc. Do you think you could put together a list of mirrors which would match
closely with specific languages?

3. Links to companies offering commercial support

This is worthy of discussion, but would have had to been planned starting
about a month ago (if not earlier). At this time, translations have
already started on the release, with plans to have it ready within the next
10 days. If you want to start working on it now, our commercial support
page could certainly use some help ...

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83
---559023410-521589464-1100300588=:25413--

Oleg,

press release will be released on behalf of PGDG ? So, any contacts
will be considered sort of official ? There so many unclear questions,
so I tried to avoid them - publish well established regional addresses.
btw, what do you mean "press contact" ? I don't remember you asked me
for contact.

When we sent out the 7.4 release, you said that you didn't know any Russian
Tech reporters, didn't have anyone to send it to, and didn't translate the
release.

Nick, on the other hand, does know some reporters, wants to send it out, and
is already translating the release.

I always have my contact (for decades) in my signature,
for example. We have well known postgresql resources in Russia and
I never heard Nickolay's company. Do we bless his company to be
our (PGDG) contact ? I'm against casual companies to be my representative
in my country !

Oleg, "companies" are not PostgreSQL community contacts. Individual people
are.

The purpose of the Regional Contact is:
1) to collect a list of press contacts in that language and send the release
to them;
2) to answer questions from press in that language;
3) to answer questions from the public, via webmaster@postgresql.org and
otherwise, in their language.

Nobody is getting paid to do this.

--
--Josh

Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco

Josh,

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

press release will be released on behalf of PGDG ? So, any contacts
will be considered sort of official ? There so many unclear questions,
so I tried to avoid them - publish well established regional addresses.
btw, what do you mean "press contact" ? I don't remember you asked me
for contact.

When we sent out the 7.4 release, you said that you didn't know any Russian
Tech reporters, didn't have anyone to send it to, and didn't translate the
release.

this is very different when you ask for *translation* or PR-ing !
I tried to separate essence of document from translating. I have nothing
against translating somebody our document and I'll help him.

Nick, on the other hand, does know some reporters, wants to send it out, and
is already translating the release.

Again, this is very different - let him send our (PGDG) press release to
president Putin, to Mars, etc, who is against :)

I always have my contact (for decades) in my signature,
for example. We have well known postgresql resources in Russia and
I never heard Nickolay's company. Do we bless his company to be
our (PGDG) contact ? I'm against casual companies to be my representative
in my country !

Oleg, "companies" are not PostgreSQL community contacts. Individual people
are.

Josh, that's what I want to hear ! Nickolay proposed to put his *company*
as contact place, that's what I'm against, nothing against Nickolay as
contact person.

The purpose of the Regional Contact is:
1) to collect a list of press contacts in that language and send the release
to them;
2) to answer questions from press in that language;
3) to answer questions from the public, via webmaster@postgresql.org and
otherwise, in their language.

Hmm, we have already Viktor Vislobokov - translator of PG documentation,
PG FAQ, and author of PG community server. You should know him for years.
And it's my opninion the best place for contact is his site !
We could write there information about contact person, phone, etc...
This is community project, at least ! I don't like connect any companies
for no reason. This is true and for my company, in spite of it actually
contributes to pg.

Nobody is getting paid to do this.

This is quite unnecessary, I didn't touch that :)

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

Oleg,

Hmm, we have already Viktor Vislobokov - translator of PG documentation,
PG FAQ, and author of PG community server.

Hmmm .... does Viktor want to do it though? What's his e-mail?

--Josh

--
--Josh

Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

Hmm, we have already Viktor Vislobokov - translator of PG documentation,
PG FAQ, and author of PG community server.

Hmmm .... does Viktor want to do it though? What's his e-mail?

I've asked him already, but didn't get any response.
His site (in Russian) http://www.linuxshare.ru/docs/software/SQL/postgresql/
email: corochoone@perm.ru
There are several disputable points (mostly translating terminology)
I want to discuss with him and Nikolay.

btw, when we say "global development group" does we imply
"international development group" ? The latter sounds better in russian.

--Josh

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

Josh,

I'm willing to finish our discussions and make sure we come to an
understanding. I think it's very important, at least to me, that
PostgreSQL should be associated with PGDG and community, not to any
company, even if it would be Fujitsu. I foresee many conflicts of
interests when PostgreSQL become even more commercial attractive.

From this point of view contact information mentioned in offical

documents should be associated with www.postgresql.org,
local web site, individual representative of PGDG (if any),
but not ANY company. Companies should be categorized as
various partners (software, development,training, strategic, business, etc)

Oleg
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004, Josh Berkus wrote:

Oleg,

press release will be released on behalf of PGDG ? So, any contacts
will be considered sort of official ? There so many unclear questions,
so I tried to avoid them - publish well established regional addresses.
btw, what do you mean "press contact" ? I don't remember you asked me
for contact.

When we sent out the 7.4 release, you said that you didn't know any Russian
Tech reporters, didn't have anyone to send it to, and didn't translate the
release.

Nick, on the other hand, does know some reporters, wants to send it out, and
is already translating the release.

I always have my contact (for decades) in my signature,
for example. We have well known postgresql resources in Russia and
I never heard Nickolay's company. Do we bless his company to be
our (PGDG) contact ? I'm against casual companies to be my representative
in my country !

Oleg, "companies" are not PostgreSQL community contacts. Individual people
are.

The purpose of the Regional Contact is:
1) to collect a list of press contacts in that language and send the release
to them;
2) to answer questions from press in that language;
3) to answer questions from the public, via webmaster@postgresql.org and
otherwise, in their language.

Nobody is getting paid to do this.

Regards,
Oleg
_____________________________________________________________
Oleg Bartunov, sci.researcher, hostmaster of AstroNet,
Sternberg Astronomical Institute, Moscow University (Russia)
Internet: oleg@sai.msu.su, http://www.sai.msu.su/~megera/
phone: +007(095)939-16-83, +007(095)939-23-83

Oleg,

I'm willing to finish our discussions and make sure we come to an
understanding. I think it's very important, at least to me, that
PostgreSQL should be associated with PGDG and community, not to any
company, even if it would be Fujitsu.

Hmmm ... hopefully you're not referring to the quote here. My goal is
actually to quote (at least) two new companies with each major release; last
time we did Inquent, Afilias, and Pisgah; this time we'll be doing Fujitsu
and Hyperic; next time, I expect probably SRA and someone else. These
quotes serve a strategic purpose, both to show that postgreSQL *does* have
major commercial adoption, and to emphasize the new features.

I foresee many conflicts of
interests when PostgreSQL become even more commercial attractive.

Fortunately, we are accustomed to being a multi-company project, and have a
lot of practice at it.

From this point of view contact information mentioned in offical
documents should be associated with www.postgresql.org,
local web site, individual representative of PGDG (if any),
but not ANY company. Companies should be categorized as
various partners (software, development,training, strategic, business, etc)

Yeah, we need to organize this on the web page. Do you have time?

--
Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco