SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

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We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

You can download SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL at:
http://www.sqlmanager.net/products/postgresql/manager/download

You can purchase SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL at:
http://www.sqlmanager.net/products/postgresql/manager/buy

What's new in SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL?
1. Support of UTF8 data in SQL Editor, Query Builder, Grid View, Data
Export/Import Wizard.
2. Now you can continue working with SQL Manager while a query is
being executed in SQL Editor or Query Builder or while table or view
data are being loaded in the editor. A query taking too long to
execute can be aborted when using PostgreSQL 8.0 and higher.
3. New Database Statistics form added; it allows viewing various
statistic information on database objects, helps to find weak points
in database performance, indicates if it's necessary to create new
indices, etc. The corresponding options must be enabled in server
configuration file (postgresql.conf.) for collecting statistics.
4. All Wizards, including Data Export/Import, DB Extract, Copy DB
wizards can now be run in the background mode, so that you could
continue working with the program.
5. New improved SQL Editor of the Visual Studio 2005 kind with Code
Folding function and UNICODE support.
6. Improved Data Import Wizard now allows to import data up to 10
times faster. New import formats have been added: HTML, XML Document,
Open Document Format (OpenOffice), Open XML Format (MS Word 2007, MS
Excel 2007).
7. Support of new PostgreSQL 8.2 features is implemented (FILLFACTOR
parameter for tables and indices, CONNECT permission for databases,
USAGE permission for sequences, support of CREATE INDEX CONCURRENTLY,
ALTER TABLE [ NO ] INHERIT support, creating domains based on other
domains, support of IF EXISTS clause in DROP operators of the Extract
Database Wizard, reassigning ownership of all objects owned by a
role).
8. Object editors now contain the Permissions tab which allows to
grant permissions on the object for users and groups.
9. Common SQL commands can now be generated from DB Explorer (Script
to SQL Editor, Script to Clipboard). Now you can easily generate such
SQL commands as CREATE, ALTER, DROP, SELECT etc for each database
object.
10. Now you can save your queries in the Favorite Queries folders in
DB Explorer; these queries О©╫an be stored either locally in the
registry (nobody but you will have access to them) or in a special
database table (then all or some of your db users will have access to
it).
11. Download File wizard has been added, which allows to download and
upload files from/to PostgreSQL server machine using standard
PostgreSQL functions and FTP/SFTP protocols.
12. Improved Visual database designer; new object type - comments - is
added. One can now choose whether only object names or fields should
be displayed. Now it is possible to select schemas whose tables should
be added to the diagram when performing Reverse Engineering.
13. Improved Data Export Wizard now works faster. New export formats
have been added: XML Document, Open Document Format (OpenOffice), Open
XML Format (MS Word 2007, MS Excel 2007).
14. Database Properties window has been added, which displays database
options and allows to change some of them.
15. Improved Table Editor. Now it is possible to view and change table
properties on a new tab.
16. Tasks menu is added in DB Explorer context menu. It contains
common operations which can be performed on the object selected. Also
hosts are now named in accordance with the selected connection type
(SSH or HTTP tunneling).
17. Improved report building system.
18. Function Debugger. The variable that changed its value at the last
step is displayed bold at the Debug Information window. The SQLSTATE
and SQLERRM variables are also displayed now.
19. Lots of other improvements and bug-fixes.

Hope you will enjoy working with our software.

#2Lim Berger
straightfwd007@gmail.com
In reply to: EMS Database Management Solutions (SQLManager.net) (#1)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

On May 23, 8:47 am, "EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net)" <sqlmana...@gmail.com> wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

You can download SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL at:http://www.sqlmanager.net/products/postgresql/manager/download

You can purchase SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL at:http://www.sqlmanager.net/products/postgresql/manager/buy

What's new in SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL?

<snip>

Thanks for this, but is there any plan to launch something like this
for use on Linux admin servers? Something that I could install on a
server, and perhaps work with a web interface? I would love some
recommendations.

Many thanks!
LB

--
Conan O' Brien gets it right!
http://blogs.pcworld.com/tipsandtweaks/archives/004369.html

In reply to: Lim Berger (#2)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

On 23/05/2007 11:40, L. Berger wrote:

Thanks for this, but is there any plan to launch something like this
for use on Linux admin servers? Something that I could install on a
server, and perhaps work with a web interface? I would love some
recommendations.

Have you tried PHPPgAdmin? I use it all the time and am very happy with it.

Ray.

---------------------------------------------------------------
Raymond O'Donnell, Director of Music, Galway Cathedral, Ireland
rod@iol.ie
---------------------------------------------------------------

#4Nikolay Samokhvalov
samokhvalov@gmail.com
In reply to: EMS Database Management Solutions (SQLManager.net) (#1)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

On 22 May 2007 17:47:46 -0700, EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net) <sqlmanager@gmail.com> wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

I'd be happy to use EMS products, but I really need Linux versions.
Any plans regarding *nix platforms support?

--
Best regards,
Nikolay

#5Michael Glaesemann
grzm@seespotcode.net
In reply to: EMS Database Management Solutions (SQLManager.net) (#1)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

On May 22, 2007, at 19:47 , EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net) wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

Congratulations on the release. In the future, refrain from posting
product announcements to the pgsql-general list. Thanks!

Michael Glaesemann
grzm seespotcode net

#6Kenneth Downs
ken@secdat.com
In reply to: Nikolay Samokhvalov (#4)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

Nikolay Samokhvalov wrote:

On 22 May 2007 17:47:46 -0700, EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net) <sqlmanager@gmail.com> wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

I'd be happy to use EMS products, but I really need Linux versions.
Any plans regarding *nix platforms support?

Ditto, when will we see the *nix versions?

--
Kenneth Downs
Secure Data Software, Inc.
www.secdat.com www.andromeda-project.org
631-689-7200 Fax: 631-689-0527
cell: 631-379-0010

#7Guillaume Lelarge
guillaume@lelarge.info
In reply to: Kenneth Downs (#6)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

Kenneth Downs a �crit :

Nikolay Samokhvalov wrote:

On 22 May 2007 17:47:46 -0700, EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net) <sqlmanager@gmail.com> wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

I'd be happy to use EMS products, but I really need Linux versions.
Any plans regarding *nix platforms support?

Ditto, when will we see the *nix versions?

I asked them some time ago. They answered me this :

As for SQL Manager for PostgreSQL - we regret to inform you that the
development and support of Linux editions of EMS software products has
become impossible now that Borland no longer supports Kylix libraries
for Delphi, on which all Linux versions of EMS software were based.
Hence, EMS has made a decision to discontinue Linux versions of its
products. Linux products will not be available for sale or download anymore.

--
Guillaume.
<!-- http://abs.traduc.org/
http://lfs.traduc.org/
http://docs.postgresqlfr.org/ -->

#8louis gonzales
gonzales@linuxlouis.net
In reply to: Guillaume Lelarge (#7)
Slightly OT.

Group,
I have to admit, I'm a little disappointed. I'm a HUGE advocate of
PostgreSQL(to state for the record) - in fact I always keep my eyes peeled
for opportunities to recommend it in my day to day business.

So why am I disappointed, and who really cares?

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication! PostgreSQL is going through all of the releases
- and that's great - BUT, where is the sync-up with the powerhouse of a
component, that Slony-II would bring to the table? Slony-I is pretty
sweet, but if Slony-II would release, I can imagine that this would
introduce some major competition in the enterprise world against the
commercial dyno's.

I've been doing some really cool stuff with the latest versions of
OpenLDAP and PostgreSQL on Solaris 10(in the past Solaris 9) also using
Linux(Fedora Core - go Redhat).

Anyone have any thoughts/comments to this end?

On Fri, 1 Jun 2007, Guillaume Lelarge wrote:

Kenneth Downs a �crit :

Nikolay Samokhvalov wrote:

On 22 May 2007 17:47:46 -0700, EMS Database Management Solutions
(SQLManager.net) <sqlmanager@gmail.com> wrote:

We, here at EMS Database Management Solutions, are pleased to announce
SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL - the new major version of the
powerful PostgreSQL administration and development tool!

I'd be happy to use EMS products, but I really need Linux versions.
Any plans regarding *nix platforms support?

Ditto, when will we see the *nix versions?

I asked them some time ago. They answered me this :

As for SQL Manager for PostgreSQL - we regret to inform you that the
development and support of Linux editions of EMS software products has
become impossible now that Borland no longer supports Kylix libraries
for Delphi, on which all Linux versions of EMS software were based.
Hence, EMS has made a decision to discontinue Linux versions of its
products. Linux products will not be available for sale or download anymore.

--
Louis Gonzales
louis.gonzales@linuxlouis.net
http://www.linuxlouis.net

#9Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: louis gonzales (#8)
Re: Slightly OT.

gonzales@linuxlouis.net wrote:

Group,
I have to admit, I'm a little disappointed. I'm a HUGE advocate of
PostgreSQL(to state for the record) - in fact I always keep my eyes
peeled for opportunities to recommend it in my day to day business.

So why am I disappointed, and who really cares?

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication! PostgreSQL is going through all of the
releases - and that's great - BUT, where is the sync-up with the
powerhouse of a component, that Slony-II would bring to the table?
Slony-I is pretty sweet, but if Slony-II would release, I can imagine
that this would introduce some major competition in the enterprise world
against the commercial dyno's.

Which databases ship with multi-master replication?

Joshua D. Drake

--

=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/

#10louis gonzales
gonzales@linuxlouis.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#9)
Re: Slightly OT.

On Fri, 1 Jun 2007, Joshua D. Drake wrote:

gonzales@linuxlouis.net wrote:

Group,
I have to admit, I'm a little disappointed. I'm a HUGE advocate of
PostgreSQL(to state for the record) - in fact I always keep my eyes peeled
for opportunities to recommend it in my day to day business.

So why am I disappointed, and who really cares?

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication! PostgreSQL is going through all of the releases
- and that's great - BUT, where is the sync-up with the powerhouse of a
component, that Slony-II would bring to the table? Slony-I is pretty
sweet, but if Slony-II would release, I can imagine that this would
introduce some major competition in the enterprise world against the
commercial dyno's.

Which databases ship with multi-master replication?

I dunno, which ones?

Which ones have robust and fully functional multi-master replication?
(Oracle, MS SQL, not-PostgreSQL).

Joshua D. Drake

--
Louis Gonzales
louis.gonzales@linuxlouis.net
http://www.linuxlouis.net

#11Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: louis gonzales (#8)
Re: Slightly OT.

On 6/1/07, gonzales@linuxlouis.net <gonzales@linuxlouis.net> wrote:

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication!

I wouldn't pin all my hopes on a project still under development. (For
me, personally, add the fact that Slony-I still has not solved
single-master replication in a way that doesn't burden the
developer/DBA with lots of unnecessary extra maintenance; I am not
counting on its developers to fix this issue in Slony-II.)

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I
can't speak for its maturity, and it may or may not scale as well as
the projected Slony-II design, but the setup seems dead simple, and
from the docs I have found it seems to transparently replicate schema
changes, unlike Slony-I. So that's something.

Alexander.

#12Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: louis gonzales (#10)
Re: Slightly OT.

gonzales@linuxlouis.net wrote:

On Fri, 1 Jun 2007, Joshua D. Drake wrote:

Which databases ship with multi-master replication?

I dunno, which ones?

Which ones have robust and fully functional multi-master replication?
(Oracle, MS SQL, not-PostgreSQL).

You consider Oracle RAC fully functional multi-master?

You do realize that Oracle is the second largest software company in the
world right? With Microsoft being number 1?

Tell ya what, write me a check, we will get right on it ;0

Joshua D. Drake

Joshua D. Drake

--

=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/

#13Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#11)
Re: Slightly OT.

Alexander Staubo wrote:

On 6/1/07, gonzales@linuxlouis.net <gonzales@linuxlouis.net> wrote:

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication!

I wouldn't pin all my hopes on a project still under development. (For
me, personally, add the fact that Slony-I still has not solved
single-master replication in a way that doesn't burden the
developer/DBA with lots of unnecessary extra maintenance; I am not
counting on its developers to fix this issue in Slony-II.)

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I
can't speak for its maturity, and it may or may not scale as well as
the projected Slony-II design, but the setup seems dead simple, and
from the docs I have found it seems to transparently replicate schema
changes, unlike Slony-I. So that's something.

I could be completely cranked but I believe that product is based on
PgCluster which is horrendously slow.

To be fair, it is still under heavy development and does show promise.

Joshua D. Drake

Alexander.

---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend

--

=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/

#14Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#13)
Re: Slightly OT.

On 6/1/07, Joshua D. Drake <jd@commandprompt.com> wrote:

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I

[snip]

I could be completely cranked but I believe that product is based on
PgCluster which is horrendously slow.

Well, dang, that's disappointing. Last I checked, the PGCluster design
was fundamentally unscalable.

Alexander.

#15Dave Page
dpage@pgadmin.org
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#14)
Re: Slightly OT.

Alexander Staubo wrote:

On 6/1/07, Joshua D. Drake <jd@commandprompt.com> wrote:

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I

[snip]

I could be completely cranked but I believe that product is based on
PgCluster which is horrendously slow.

Well, dang, that's disappointing. Last I checked, the PGCluster design
was fundamentally unscalable.

Multimaster replication generally is - thats why Slony-2 will almost
certainly never exist in the form that it was originally imagined.
Although I'm not (and never have been) an Oracle user, I've heard that
RAC has it's own issues in this area as well.

Regards, Dave

#16Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Dave Page (#15)
Re: Slightly OT.

Dave Page wrote:

Alexander Staubo wrote:

On 6/1/07, Joshua D. Drake <jd@commandprompt.com> wrote:

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I

[snip]

I could be completely cranked but I believe that product is based on
PgCluster which is horrendously slow.

Well, dang, that's disappointing. Last I checked, the PGCluster design
was fundamentally unscalable.

Multimaster replication generally is - thats why Slony-2 will almost
certainly never exist in the form that it was originally imagined.
Although I'm not (and never have been) an Oracle user, I've heard that
RAC has it's own issues in this area as well.

IMO, the future is application partitioning, not multi-master.

Also, what I find interesting here is that PostgreSQL on modest hardware
does excessively well.

I have a client right now that is running an 8 core, 16 gig box with
only 14 spindles.

They are processing 6ktps and it takes 14 tomcat servers to bring the
database down.

Any multi-master solution is going to fall over well before 6ktps.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake

P.S. I should note that we are working toward more than 6ktps and will
report back ;)

Regards, Dave

--

=== The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. ===
Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240
Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997
http://www.commandprompt.com/

Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/

#17Tony Caduto
tony_caduto@amsoftwaredesign.com
In reply to: Guillaume Lelarge (#7)
Re: SQL Manager 2007 for PostgreSQL released

Guillaume Lelarge wrote:

I asked them some time ago. They answered me this :

As for SQL Manager for PostgreSQL - we regret to inform you that the
development and support of Linux editions of EMS software products has
become impossible now that Borland no longer supports Kylix libraries
for Delphi, on which all Linux versions of EMS software were based.
Hence, EMS has made a decision to discontinue Linux versions of its
products. Linux products will not be available for sale or download anymore.

Just a FYI, their win32 versions will probably work fine in Linux via WINE.

Lightning Admin does anyway(work via WINE) and they program their
products with Delphi as well, so I think it would work fine.

Just one word of advice about WINE, make sure you have the core MS true
type fonts installed or the win32 apps will look funny, especially when
using editors.

Later,

--
Tony Caduto
AM Software Design
http://www.amsoftwaredesign.com
Home of PG Lightning Admin for Postgresql
Your best option for Postgresql Administration

#18louis gonzales
gonzales@linuxlouis.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#16)
Re: Slightly OT.

It does so well because it KICKS ICE!

On Fri, 1 Jun 2007, Joshua D. Drake wrote:

Dave Page wrote:

Alexander Staubo wrote:

On 6/1/07, Joshua D. Drake <jd@commandprompt.com> wrote:

In the meantime, Cybertec (http://www.postgresql.at/, an Austrian
company) just announced a commercial synchronous multimaster
replication product based on 2-phase commit. It's expensive, and I

[snip]

I could be completely cranked but I believe that product is based on
PgCluster which is horrendously slow.

Well, dang, that's disappointing. Last I checked, the PGCluster design
was fundamentally unscalable.

Multimaster replication generally is - thats why Slony-2 will almost
certainly never exist in the form that it was originally imagined.
Although I'm not (and never have been) an Oracle user, I've heard that
RAC has it's own issues in this area as well.

IMO, the future is application partitioning, not multi-master.

Also, what I find interesting here is that PostgreSQL on modest hardware does
excessively well.

I have a client right now that is running an 8 core, 16 gig box with only 14
spindles.

They are processing 6ktps and it takes 14 tomcat servers to bring the
database down.

Any multi-master solution is going to fall over well before 6ktps.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Drake

P.S. I should note that we are working toward more than 6ktps and will report
back ;)

Regards, Dave

--
Louis Gonzales
louis.gonzales@linuxlouis.net
http://www.linuxlouis.net

#19Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: louis gonzales (#8)
multimaster (was: Slightly OT.)

As an aside -- please don't start new topics in old threads.

On Fri, Jun 01, 2007 at 10:42:02AM -0400, gonzales@linuxlouis.net wrote:

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication!

Well, I wouldn't hold my breath. Most of the participants in that
project moved on, after concluding either that it wasn't going to
solve their problems, or concluding that it'd cost too much to
develop and support for the likely benefit it would deliver. As near
as I can tell, development on the project stopped.

The inspiration for the Slony-II project, Postgres-R, has been ported
forward to 8.x series by Markus Schiltknecht. Last I heard, he was
looking for people to underwrite his work on that project. So if you
really want those features, the obvious way to do it is to put a
programmer on it, and there happens to be a programmer who has a demo
as his argument that it can be done, and he can do it.

I think you have to understand, however, that Slony-II or Postgres-R
was not in fact the magic carpet you seem to think it was to be.
There are some pretty significant limitations to the async
multimaster approach it uses. To begin with, AFAIK nobody has a
working, production-grade group communication system available for
use by Postgres -- the ones that the prototypes were built on were
pretty hacky, and appeared not to be ready for prime time. Second,
nobody has come up with any way to make this work with READ COMMITTED
mode, which means you pay a really huge price for the replication.

My real question in all this is, "What is the problem you are trying
to solve?" Hot failover using combinations of hardware and software,
and a disk array that can be mounted across two machines, is actually
probably good enough for most cases, assuming it is implemented
correctly (see recent discussion on this topic). So the availability
piece is mostly solved. What else do you want?

A

--
Andrew Sullivan | ajs@crankycanuck.ca
When my information changes, I alter my conclusions. What do you do sir?
--attr. John Maynard Keynes

#20louis gonzales
gonzales@linuxlouis.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#19)
Re: multimaster (was: Slightly OT.)

Let me clarify - I don't know how/where the thought is that I need
something per se, I personally like deploying the scaled solutions and
playing with software that others have written. Can I deploy the right
hardware and configurations to meet pretty much near anything anyone could
ever need? I say yes, I can. BUT it would so much cooler IF, there was a
multi-master environment configured for the sake of doing it.

I'm glad that not everyone has this disposition about 'why do we need it.'
The pursuit of knowledge is the facilitator of innovation.

As I mentioned, in initial post, I've got OpenLDAP integrated with
postgresql & another application, which my friends and I are going to
release soon as a service - we'll see how far that goes. Nonetheless, I
would like to have a multi-master postrgresql cluster handling my backend
content.

Why? Because I'd like to. If you're happy with not using pursuing it,
great, that works for you. Sweet! Killer! Rock on! My take away is, now
besides knowing their's no active pursuit on the matter, perhaps others in
this huge forum, now know more status, thanks to those of 'you' who are so
up to date! In all sincerity, thank you for clarifying that status.

There are still advanced users our here, who would still like to see an
opensource product reach that level stature, such that those who don't
know - i.e. 'most' managers and people who have decision making power -
would not be deterred from using Postgresql because it doesn't have a
quote unquote, 'multi-mater' replication.

On Fri, 1 Jun 2007, Andrew Sullivan wrote:

As an aside -- please don't start new topics in old threads.

On Fri, Jun 01, 2007 at 10:42:02AM -0400, gonzales@linuxlouis.net wrote:

I'm disappointed because SLONY-II has not been released yet to support
multi-master replication!

Well, I wouldn't hold my breath. Most of the participants in that
project moved on, after concluding either that it wasn't going to
solve their problems, or concluding that it'd cost too much to
develop and support for the likely benefit it would deliver. As near
as I can tell, development on the project stopped.

The inspiration for the Slony-II project, Postgres-R, has been ported
forward to 8.x series by Markus Schiltknecht. Last I heard, he was
looking for people to underwrite his work on that project. So if you
really want those features, the obvious way to do it is to put a
programmer on it, and there happens to be a programmer who has a demo
as his argument that it can be done, and he can do it.

I think you have to understand, however, that Slony-II or Postgres-R
was not in fact the magic carpet you seem to think it was to be.
There are some pretty significant limitations to the async
multimaster approach it uses. To begin with, AFAIK nobody has a
working, production-grade group communication system available for
use by Postgres -- the ones that the prototypes were built on were
pretty hacky, and appeared not to be ready for prime time. Second,
nobody has come up with any way to make this work with READ COMMITTED
mode, which means you pay a really huge price for the replication.

My real question in all this is, "What is the problem you are trying
to solve?" Hot failover using combinations of hardware and software,
and a disk array that can be mounted across two machines, is actually
probably good enough for most cases, assuming it is implemented
correctly (see recent discussion on this topic). So the availability
piece is mostly solved. What else do you want?

A

--
Louis Gonzales
louis.gonzales@linuxlouis.net
http://www.linuxlouis.net

#21Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: louis gonzales (#20)
#22Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#11)
#23Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#21)
#24Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#23)
#25Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Jeff Davis (#22)
#26Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#25)
#27Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#25)
#28Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#23)
#29Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#24)
#30Tom Lane
tgl@sss.pgh.pa.us
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#25)
#31Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#29)
#32Chris Browne
cbbrowne@acm.org
In reply to: EMS Database Management Solutions (SQLManager.net) (#1)
#33Chris Browne
cbbrowne@acm.org
In reply to: EMS Database Management Solutions (SQLManager.net) (#1)
#34Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#19)
#35Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#26)
#36Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#27)
#37Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#34)
#38Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#35)
#39Bruce Momjian
bruce@momjian.us
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#35)
#40Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Bruce Momjian (#39)
#41Scott Ribe
scott_ribe@killerbytes.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#40)
#42Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#37)
#43Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Scott Ribe (#41)
#44Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#38)
#45Guy Rouillier
guyr-ml1@burntmail.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#23)
#46Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#40)
#47Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#44)
#48Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#40)
#49Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#47)
#50Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Andrew Sullivan (#46)
#51Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#49)
#52Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Jeff Davis (#48)
#53Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#51)
#54Joshua D. Drake
jd@commandprompt.com
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#53)
#55Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#24)
#56Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Guy Rouillier (#45)
#57Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#52)
#58Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Chris Browne (#33)
#59Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Joshua D. Drake (#54)
#60Ron Johnson
ron.l.johnson@cox.net
In reply to: Jeff Davis (#57)
#61Greg Smith
gsmith@gregsmith.com
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#34)
#62PFC
lists@peufeu.com
In reply to: Guy Rouillier (#45)
#63Martijn van Oosterhout
kleptog@svana.org
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#55)
#64Rodrigo Gonzalez
rjgonzale@gmail.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#56)
#65Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Martijn van Oosterhout (#63)
#66Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#49)
#67Andrew Sullivan
ajs@crankycanuck.ca
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#50)
#68Guy Rouillier
guyr-ml1@burntmail.com
In reply to: PFC (#62)
#69Ian Harding
harding.ian@gmail.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#65)
#70Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Ian Harding (#69)
#71Martijn van Oosterhout
kleptog@svana.org
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#70)
#72Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Martijn van Oosterhout (#71)
#73Tino Wildenhain
tino@wildenhain.de
In reply to: Lim Berger (#2)
#74Scott Ribe
scott_ribe@killerbytes.com
In reply to: Greg Smith (#61)
#75Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#72)
#76Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Jeff Davis (#75)
#77Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#76)
#78Tino Wildenhain
tino@wildenhain.de
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#23)
#79Alexander Staubo
alex@purefiction.net
In reply to: Tino Wildenhain (#78)
#80Jeff Davis
pgsql@j-davis.com
In reply to: Ron Johnson (#60)
#81Karsten Hilbert
Karsten.Hilbert@gmx.net
In reply to: Alexander Staubo (#70)