PostgreSQL mission statement?

mlw <markw@mohawksoft.com> writes:

Just out of curiosity, does PostgreSQL have a mission statement?

Nope. Given the wide variety of views among the developer community,
I think we'd have a tough time agreeing on a mission statement, unless
it was so generic as to be meaningless ...

regards, tom lane

mlw <markw@mohawksoft.com> writes:

Just out of curiosity, does PostgreSQL have a mission statement?

Nope. Given the wide variety of views among the developer community,
I think we'd have a tough time agreeing on a mission statement, unless
it was so generic as to be meaningless ...

Well, I think one of the things that has been agreed on that _isn't_
that generic is:
"We use a Berkeley style license, and prefer it that way."

:-)
--
(concatenate 'string "cbbrowne" "@ntlug.org")
http://www.ntlug.org/~cbbrowne/rdbms.html
To err is human, to moo bovine.

On Wed, May 01, 2002 at 02:24:30PM -0400, mlw wrote:

Just out of curiosity, does PostgreSQL have a mission statement?

If so, where could I find it?

If not, does anyone see a need?

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

--
David Terrell | "War is peace,
Prime Minister, Nebcorp | freedom is slavery,
dbt@meat.net | ignorance is strength
http://wwn.nebcorp.com/ | Dishes are clean." - Chris Fester

cbbrowne@cbbrowne.com wrote:

mlw <markw@mohawksoft.com> writes:

Just out of curiosity, does PostgreSQL have a mission statement?

Nope. Given the wide variety of views among the developer community,
I think we'd have a tough time agreeing on a mission statement, unless
it was so generic as to be meaningless ...

Well, I think one of the things that has been agreed on that _isn't_
that generic is:
"We use a Berkeley style license, and prefer it that way."

Does that now count as a mission? Whow, didn't know that I am
on a mission! What in our mission is mission critical? What
are our defined mission goals?

Jan :-)

:-)
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cbbrowne@cbbrowne.com wrote:

mlw <markw@mohawksoft.com> writes:

Just out of curiosity, does PostgreSQL have a mission statement?

Nope. Given the wide variety of views among the developer community,
I think we'd have a tough time agreeing on a mission statement, unless
it was so generic as to be meaningless ...

Well, I think one of the things that has been agreed on that _isn't_
that generic is:
"We use a Berkeley style license, and prefer it that way."

No! no! no! Don't even kid like that. EVERY time that debate is even mentioned,
it goes on for days.

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a écrit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a écrit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

How about "We can store your data" ?

Just a late night thought...

dali

Jean-Michel POURE wrote:

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a �crit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with it,
promote free and open source software world wide.

Who's that? Anyone disagree?

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 08:15:15AM -0400, mlw wrote:

Jean-Michel POURE wrote:

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a �crit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with
it, promote free and open source software world wide.

Who's that? Anyone disagree?

why does it have to be THE BEST ? that is insulting to the other projects
like MySQL which while "competitors" are also a valid and useful benchmark
for features, performance and keeping the postgresql community on its
collective toes.

postgresql is not THE BEST in all applications, so calling it that is inviting
derision and pointless arguments.

i'd go with:

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining a very
reliable, open-source, multi-purpose, standards-based database, and
encouraging participation in open-source usage and development world wide.

--
[ Jim Mercer jim@reptiles.org +1 416 410-5633 ]
[ I want to live forever, or die trying. ]

Jim Mercer wrote:

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 08:15:15AM -0400, mlw wrote:

Jean-Michel POURE wrote:

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a �crit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with
it, promote free and open source software world wide.

Who's that? Anyone disagree?

why does it have to be THE BEST ? that is insulting to the other projects
like MySQL which while "competitors" are also a valid and useful benchmark
for features, performance and keeping the postgresql community on its
collective toes.

This is interesting, a mission statement isn't necessarily about "what is" but
about what we "want to do," what it is that we "intend to do," i.e. "our
mission." It is vital that a mission statement contain the superlatives.
Mediocrity has no place here.

I don't know about you, but I want PostgreSQL to be the best, be THE most
reliable. Omitting "best" or "most" from the statement means that we should all
just give up now, because PostgreSQL is pretty damn good already.

Is this an indication of a need for pgsql-marketing@postgresql.org? :)

I like:

We'll store your data; if we think it'll be an interesting enough
diversion for us.

--
Nigel Andrews

On Thu, 2 May 2002, mlw wrote:

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 08:43:04AM -0400, mlw wrote:

Jim Mercer wrote:

why does it have to be THE BEST ? that is insulting to the other projects
like MySQL which while "competitors" are also a valid and useful benchmark
for features, performance and keeping the postgresql community on its
collective toes.

This is interesting, a mission statement isn't necessarily about "what is" but
about what we "want to do," what it is that we "intend to do," i.e. "our
mission." It is vital that a mission statement contain the superlatives.
Mediocrity has no place here.

I don't know about you, but I want PostgreSQL to be the best, be THE most
reliable. Omitting "best" or "most" from the statement means that we should
all just give up now, because PostgreSQL is pretty damn good already.

i think a mission statement full of boastfulness is just a sound bite, and
will be dismissed as such.

if you want the mission statement to have an impact, then it needs to be
acceptable not only to those who fully embrace it, but also acceptable to
those who will respect the project from a distance.

otherwise its not a mission statement, its akin to a corporate cheer.
( i'm picturing Steve Balmer's superlative exhaltations to the converted
http://www.ntk.net/ballmer/mirrors.html )

--
[ Jim Mercer jim@reptiles.org +1 416 410-5633 ]
[ I want to live forever, or die trying. ]

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 01:43:39PM +0100, Nigel J. Andrews wrote:

I like:

We'll store your data; if we think it'll be an interesting enough
diversion for us.

gets my vote.

8^)

--
[ Jim Mercer jim@reptiles.org +1 416 410-5633 ]
[ I want to live forever, or die trying. ]

I don't know about you, but I want PostgreSQL to be the best, be

THE most

reliable. Omitting "best" or "most" from the statement means that

we should

all just give up now, because PostgreSQL is pretty damn good

already.

i think a mission statement full of boastfulness is just a sound

bite, and

will be dismissed as such.

Theres no reason Postgresql can't be the best in a good majority if
not all of the fields. Yeah, a few things are needed to accomplish
this -- but theres no reason it can't happen.

Anyway, most companies do something like 'Postgresql will become the
choice database'. That is, majority market share.

That said, they're dumb. They need to be changed once you meet the
goal.

A good mission statement should last the lifetime of the company /
department / project. WalMart actually has one of the better ones,
where their mission is to beat last years sales by x%. 3M will
innovate. HP would not release a product unless it offered the market
something new or better (they don't [ didn't for years anyway ] clone
others stuff and undercut them in price).

Perhaps Postgresql should have the mission of handling twice the
amount of data this year than last. That is, all collective
installations will maintain more stuff. Difficult to measure, but
would ensure we create / maintain the features required by big and
small databases. Currently those features appear to be relational
design, reliability, etc. Should the data storage requirements
change, Postgresql would have to follow in order to maintain it's
mission statement which is a good thing.

Goals should change, (being most reliable, or ANSI compliant) but
purpose should be consistent.

That said, skip the whole thing. I don't think we need something to
rally behind as it's kinda self explanatory why you'd donate time or
money to the project. It needs to meet your needs first, which
averaged out between all of the developers will meet those of most
others. DBs work that way, desktops often don't ;)

On Thu, 2002-05-02 at 14:37, Jim Mercer wrote:

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 08:15:15AM -0400, mlw wrote:

Who's that? Anyone disagree?

why does it have to be THE BEST ? that is insulting to the other projects
like MySQL which while "competitors" are also a valid and useful benchmark
for features, performance and keeping the postgresql community on its
collective toes.

postgresql is not THE BEST in all applications, so calling it that is inviting
derision and pointless arguments.

The Politically Correct mission statement follows:

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining a good
but not the best, mostly reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards
based database, and with it, promote free and open source software and
other worthy causes world wide and to not hurting anyones feelings in doing so.
We are also committed to not cheating our SOs, not charging too much for
our services nor eating too much and to recommending products of our
commercial competitors before ours in order to help them fullfil their
obligations to their stockholders.

I was hoping to fit in something about being a good
Christian/Muslim/Atheist but was unable to do it in an universally
acceptable way.
There may be other points that are not valid everywhere though.

BTW, I think PostgreSQL does _not_ need any mission statement.

-------------
Hannu

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with
it, promote free(dom) and open source software world wide.

I hope you don't mind writing "free(dom)" with the idea of fighting patent
abuses.

Cheers,
Jean-Michel

On Thursday 02 May 2002 08:56 am, Jim Mercer wrote:

i think a mission statement full of boastfulness is just a sound bite, and
will be dismissed as such.

if you want the mission statement to have an impact, then it needs to be
acceptable not only to those who fully embrace it, but also acceptable to
those who will respect the project from a distance.

otherwise its not a mission statement, its akin to a corporate cheer.
( i'm picturing Steve Balmer's superlative exhaltations to the converted
http://www.ntk.net/ballmer/mirrors.html )

In the corporate world a mission statement is often the 'sound bite' and a
'corporate cheer'.

I personally think
"To have fun making and improving the most extensible, robust, ACID-compliant
Free database system on the planet" wraps up at least why I think we're all
here. s/Free/Open Source/g if you'd rather not invoke a stallmanism. Or
even s/Free/BSD-licensed/g if you want to really state the obvious. :-)

If other projects' members are insulted by that, then they're just too
sensitive.
--
Lamar Owen
WGCR Internet Radio
1 Peter 4:11

Jean-Michel POURE wrote:

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with
it, promote free(dom) and open source software world wide.

I hope you don't mind writing "free(dom)" with the idea of fighting patent
abuses.

No, the mission statement is about what the postgresql group, as a whole, is
all about.

I know it seems silly to have such a thing, but really, the more I read on this
discussion, the more it seems like it is a useful "call to arms" for developers
and users alike.

Now, I do not wish to have a manifesto, but a short and sweet "this is who we
are, and this is what we do" could be a positive thing.

P.S. I think every software engineer worth anything should fight software
patents. If Donald Knuth didn't patent his algorithms, practically none of us
deserve patents. I mean seriously, most of the software patents are trivial and
obvious. Knuth did something, most of us only build on his work.

On Thu, 2 May 2002, mlw wrote:

Jim Mercer wrote:

On Thu, May 02, 2002 at 08:15:15AM -0400, mlw wrote:

Jean-Michel POURE wrote:

Le Jeudi 2 Mai 2002 01:59, David Terrell a ���crit :

"Provide a really good database and have fun doing it"

PostgreSQL Community is commited to providing Humanity with the best
multi-purpose, reliable, open-source and free database system.

The PostgreSQL community is committed to creating and maintaining the best,
most reliable, open-source multi-purpose standards based database, and with
it, promote free and open source software world wide.

Who's that? Anyone disagree?

why does it have to be THE BEST ? that is insulting to the other projects
like MySQL which while "competitors" are also a valid and useful benchmark
for features, performance and keeping the postgresql community on its
collective toes.

This is interesting, a mission statement isn't necessarily about "what is" but
about what we "want to do," what it is that we "intend to do," i.e. "our
mission." It is vital that a mission statement contain the superlatives.
Mediocrity has no place here.

I don't know about you, but I want PostgreSQL to be the best, be THE most
reliable. Omitting "best" or "most" from the statement means that we should all
just give up now, because PostgreSQL is pretty damn good already.

altho in most contexts, I would agree with Jim as to the use of 'The
Best', for any mission statement to say anything other then that, IMHO,
shows a lack of commitment ... I agree with mlw on this one, the mission
statement is what we are *striving* for ... where we eventually want to
get to ... if we aren't "The Best", then there is someone better then us
that we have to work that much harder to become better then ...

I personally like mlw's wording ...